I am interested in working in the substance misuse area (voluntary considered). But have been told that becuase i am on methadone I cant (ref CAN and other local drug agencies).

Does anyone know of organisations in the east mids area or websites, telephone helplines etc or anything else, who might need someone who has an indepth knowledge of substance abuse and is degree educated (psychology 2:1, also neuropharmacology), and a pretty good listner, can emphathise well????

Any ideas?

Thanks in anticipation.

Why tell your future employers you are on a script. Do they need to know...
The two year drug free rule isnt realy a rule its a twisted policy that people keep relating to a nomark suggestion made in isdd (drug Scope) in the 80's.
I would say target homeless services were the money can be better, than drug services. The path of least resistance....
Agency work could be available...
Some organisation like the healthy options team in london offer 'volunteer to work' schemes for current users.
There could be situations like so, to tap into.
I did 3 years voluntary work every day in body positive a hiv/aids drop in support service. this gave a me a reference and access to most support services.
Nowadays with the goverment saying they want to increase the drugs workers positions by so many thousand by 2008. people only need to do a 6 month NVQ 1 or 2 before getting paid employment. No one else other than dodgy corporate drug services have tapped into this resource. reeming loads of money.
On the other side I know a few people who have turned their back on working in services and have sourced their own training and consultancy businesses.

^only problem here is that the country i live in has a limited number of agencies most of whom know me. Thanks for the advice though.

I cannot see why this 2 year rule is in place. I havent used an illicit substance for years. And i am maintained and stable and have been stable for about 10 yrs.

I didn't know about the 2 year rule, does seem a little strict. We have several people on scripts in our User forum, not sure if they get paid but they certanly get expenses, and they get right inside the inner workings of drugs services and are doing a very useful job. I can let you have contact details via individual email if you want to know more.
Beware of not telling people you're on a script though, most empl;oyers have a health declaration form and I have a client now who lost his job as a lecturer when his methadone was found in his briefcase which he had left in the lecture theatre because his health declaration had made no mention of subs mis treatment.

susi

To be fair Banksy I think was SCODA rather that ISDD that made this suggestion (they merged to form drugscope). As you say it is not a rule and never had any formal status. Also it is not now so generally followed although it is still used in some areas as you have found. Its obviously really about whether you have the skills to do the job. I think its also worth making clear (because someone has misunderstood it on another thread) that this supposed rule applies only to jobs working in the drug dependency field.

jim

The easist answer and I have been through this process many times. Is get the guardian on wednesday, for the society section, apply for all the drug positions and when the application forms come tumbling through your door, count how many services ask if you have been drug free, for at least two years. The new addition is also non problematic alcohol users for 2 years.
To get clearance for arrest referral, I have seen 5 years quoted a few times.
Its about competency and skill...The drug treatment field isnt the easiest career option as I have seen it eat many people up and spit them out.
Drew you have a degree in psycholgy, a wealth of experential experience and a I am sure a good education behind you. I have read all your posts and you do have a way about you, which would suit people needing support to manage change.
To me, you have a big bunch of skeleton keys...its the making your mind up about which doors you want to be opening.
I had no eductaion as a kid or an adult. I have learned alot and worked for the best part of 12 years. I havent a qualification to my name. I still cant realy write...which is diffrent from being able to type. I was always good at chess, pool, football, cross words and scrabble. engagable learning routes.
My writing looks like I am possessed by a 4 individual polterguists.
If i told an employers, in interview, that I couldnt write, they wouldnt want to employ me and they would miss my compensating skills.
There are many things that people think employers should know, until one day there dignity and right to privacy is breached.
I am open about myself, I cant not be, as their are records on me stretching back to when I was born into the hands of the social services or The Cruelty which they are called in Glasgow. (many a time have I heard yelled 'Ma The cruelty is at the door')
I am off work today found out the pain in my lungs was bronchial, never had that before...will be seeing my doctor this afternoon. Its strange as I work and talk to doctors 5 days a week. I go to my doctors and I reduce myself to a child with high defences.
When I leave the surgery I always think and I know its not right...'see I didnt try and get opaites out of you' wasnt I good.

Going back, Drew think beyond what you see as drug services, as my feeling is their time is limited. Just like the Rough Sleepers initiative was limited....people were always saying 'surely they will continue the funding'...they were wrong.
After wards we even had Liouse Casey who was the homeless tsar, spouting out to papers and government that the services in place to support homeless people from starving or dying from Hypothermia, perpetuated the problem.
Which meant the end of soup runs and emergency cold weather shelters. did nobody notice the lack of cold weather shelter adverts this year. The society section is half its weight since the rough sleepers initiative was disbandened.
All these drug services with turn overs of more than ten million in a financial year, are hanging on to a cliff. Gp services are there only net.
The criminal justice intervention programs (CJIP'S) are the same as GP Shared Care its only Legal Shared Care.
Its to take the need for offending behaviour out of drug use. A bit similar to the "North Wales Chief Constable Richard Brunstrom saying people are commmiting crimes who dont realy want to but they have no choice because the drug policies turn them into offenders....I like his thinking but as far as i know he has been saying this stuff for years its not just broken.
My belief is GP services should be included into the tendoring and pooled budgets getting blindly spent by many dats and get there own drugs worker.
All they are realy doing now in the GP Shared Care contract, is handing all their results, milestones, soft indictors, in puts, out puts and targets to drug services to count up in mamangement information systems (MIS) to get more funding for services that will not benefit the surgery who gave the figures. I heard bomic is 2 years ahead of the NTA in its recording abilities.

So what I am saying, for Drew the doors are there for you to knock, it just might mean contemplating relocation.
I had to travel from Brighton to London for 3 years. Then my ma gets worried when I am not working...
In the Glasgow housing scheme, I spent my early and formative years, I ran wild for many years. I (I am going back up next week for a funeral and the collection of a pup) When many of the mothers from their, think of their O.D dead sons, they think it should have been him, me.
I fortunatelly have survived, so far and helped many people survive since. I wear guilt...

I think you might find that not everyone here will agree that CJIP schemes are the same as GP shared care, although I know what you mean in terms of being shared between criminal justice and health. However i think the holistic medical treatment package that you can get in good primary care services is a preferred option for most users.

jim

From what I've seen of your postings, you would add much insight and be a great asset to any service to substance users. I hope your knowledge/empathy/insight is recognised for what it could add to any service to users. Know it's not practical advice but should be said. James.

I was more meaning the cjip initiatives are similar in the fact its shared referral and care. They do have access to fast track people into treatment which interpretates as gaining Health Authority and Community Care Funding for detox or rehab...day programs...mmmmm crisis admissions units they come top of the pops now...thats figure crunching for you.
What I have witnessed of the cjip drive so far, is its un/dis-co/ordination due to being guided by virtual management teams and multiple managment information systems. At the moment when a cjip worker makes a referal from the cells they need to fax that form to 5 seperate data entry services. Mabe fast track means create so much paper work that we cant possible lose them, a bit like the Hansel and Gretal theory of data collection and mile stone setting.
Bridging gaps is the motto, splitting teir systems is the fear and taking criminal justice out of law and drug use is my hope.

Banksy, thanks for sharing your experiences with me, i really appeciate it. I personaly tend to worry about other employment due to my meds. I know i shouldnt but it years and years of stigma i have difficulty shaking off.

I do feel i have more to offer than fixing computers. I dont think i should be penalised in anyway as i am not a chaotic, illicit drug user, just someone who cannot operate to their full potential without medication. I shall not bore you of the ins- and outs of why this is so.

Unfortuantely, all people I have spoken to in my area say you have to be "clean" for 2 years before applying. I dont tend to think of myself as "dirty" in the first place, therefore, i tend not to apply.

Regards.

Drew

see Simons next post
jim

[This message was edited by Jim Barnard on 02 March 2004 at 09:04 PM.]

Jim
I think it's www.drugshelper.org .
Simon

cheers Simon. I was about to post and say it didn't seem to work

jim

yes, thats an excellent site. thanks Simon

Dear Drew and Others The 2 year rule was never official and probably dreamed up in someone's head! In these days of a workforce crisis and of excluding one of the potential best areas of workforce, it needs to be challenged. Work should be based on competencies.

The Alliance with Drugscope and others are looking at it. Interestingly split at the FEDAP meeting(most of the voluntary sector where there) the other day I brought it up, many agreed and some were thinking of increasing it to 3 years!

All the Alliance employees are on scripts. Why not contact Bill and discuss?

ps having a campaign about terminology we use (cause Gary told me off years ago)
Clean (ug!) = urine negative for opiates or other non-prescribed drugs
Dirty = urine positive for x, y, or z
What else slips into our vocabulary?

Chris, i take it that people who go by the 2/3 year ruling tend to lump MMT into this as "drug using"? I mean to me it seems unfair (but what is fair these days, lol) that when someone has only been on MMT for 10 yrs and no illicits - but is still branded a user/addict by such agencies.

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/library5/health/eiumoum.pdf
this is rather large and I haven't read it all but emphasis seems to be on employer/employee fit rather than some arbitratry time limit

susi

There is no legal definition about the two year rule. Thats fact. But come here lets get real. Drug free heroin users whether or not they are on long acting maintanence cannot function effectively. Why? The vast majority of work that needs to be undertaken to get someone off opiates does not relate to the actual drug. You have to stop ex-users making themselves vulnerable by putting heroin in front of them. Get rid of old acquantinences, old habits etc. Put a bag of heroin in front of an ex-user and you have got a current user. Pavlov's dogs multiplied one hundred times. I am currently treating someone who has been clean for twenty five years. Come on if you are going to operate a medical site make sure the information is at least balanced. No ex-user should be involved in counselling as the risk to the counsillor is too great.

This is not a purely 'medical' site and thus far information exchanged has been extremely balanced - it is the exchange of information that creates the balance. Your statement that no ex-user should be involved in counselling is prescriptive and flies in the face of a lot of practice and experience. What do you mean by counselling anyway? It's an incredibly ill-defined term.